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RWC Final - New Zealand vs South Africa
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Poll Question: Which team will lift the Webb Ellis Cup for the fourth time?
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IonMan View Drop Down
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Points: 158 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote IonMan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Oct 2023 at 11:41
As has been said elsewhere the sad part about SA win is it will drive the game further into heavyweights are required if you wish to win, taking us away from the claim that it is a sport for all sizes. At least the game wasn't decided on scrum penalties.
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Megrim View Drop Down
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Points: 38 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Megrim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Oct 2023 at 12:09
Yet Fourie &,Smith  were outstanding in the loose., both wingers & de Klerk also put in fine performance's.
None of them exactly giants.
Colin Richards
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WEvans View Drop Down
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Points: 1456 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WEvans Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Oct 2023 at 12:27
Originally posted by PM009 PM009 wrote:

Cane’s was direct shoulder contact to the head when he’s not lowered his height. Doesn’t matter what the Kriel does with his height if the tackler doesn’t lower and make direct contact he’s gone.

Kolisi wasn’t direct contact, first contact went through the shoulder which was mitigation.

Both were refereed correctly to the law, wether you like the law or not is another question but both correct

Quite agree so it seems not everyone shares the earlier opinion!
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Moseley Mauler View Drop Down
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Points: 690 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Moseley Mauler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Oct 2023 at 13:07
Did I watch the game? Yes.  Did I enjoy it? No. If it hadn't been the World Cup Final I would have switched it off.  The professional game is becoming a joke. Matches seem to be between 2 sides merely trying gain territory and force errors and then trying to win penalties at scrum time. For the latter I totally blame referees from 15 plus years ago when they stopped applying the laws about putting the ball in straight and so the scrum moved away from a means of just restarting the game.  Line-outs are going the same way now. What has happened to exciting running rugby?  Potential solutions? Free kicks for scum offences and 7 points for a try scored from open play. Attacking rolling mauls from line outs banned from within the 22.  And there should be no hands on the floor at rucks both for defending and attacking teams.  OK, I'm living on fantasy island....But I am becoming disillusioned 
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Points: 4309 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Halliford Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Oct 2023 at 17:54
I found the match compelling. NZ lost because of two missed kicks and two key handling errors. SA won because they didn’t make mistakes at key points. I thought the refereeing team were calm, assured, communicative and applied the current Laws well - not their job to determine whether those Laws are correct.

Having coached for 30 years I tend to watch as a coach, so i can enjoy the way a defence coach sets up to counter the attacking play. Both sets of coaches are experts at what is quite similar to an American Football approach. The size and power of players is now such that creating clear linebreaks relies on errors by the defence more often than not and these two teams rarely make those errors.
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Runitback View Drop Down
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Points: 1225 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Runitback Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Oct 2023 at 19:50
Totally agree with Moseley Mauler, simple solutions. Staight puts ins at scrum, but most importantly on 3 subs ( injury only replacements ). Suddenly you cannot be 20 stone and play 80 minutes. 
Run with it
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islander View Drop Down
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Points: 7870 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote islander Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Oct 2023 at 21:08
Originally posted by Halliford Halliford wrote:

I found the match compelling. NZ lost because of two missed kicks and two key handling errors. SA won because they didn’t make mistakes at key points. I thought the refereeing team were calm, assured, communicative and applied the current Laws well - not their job to determine whether those Laws are correct.


Agree Halliford, thought Barnes did well; comparing his calm authority with Nic Berry being on the verge of losing control (of a lower-stakes game) the night before reveals a night and day difference.

But the TMO thing is increasingly random - some incidents referred, others not, little or no transparency regarding the bunker. And apparently (Daily Telegraph reports) death threats to the ref on social media during the game. How sad...


Edited by islander - 30 Oct 2023 at 07:13
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tulip View Drop Down
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Points: 2234 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tulip Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Oct 2023 at 07:04
[QUOTE=Moseley Mauler]Did I watch the game? Yes.  Did I enjoy it? No. If it hadn't been the World Cup Final I would have switched it off.  The professional game is becoming a joke. Matches seem to be between 2 sides merely trying gain territory and force errors and then trying to win penalties at scrum time. For the latter I totally blame referees from 15 plus years ago when they stopped applying the laws about putting the ball in straight and so the scrum moved away from a means of just restarting the game.  Line-outs are going the same way now. What has happened to exciting running rugby?  Potential solutions? Free kicks for scum offences and 7 points for a try scored from open play. Attacking rolling mauls from line outs banned from within the 22.  And there should be no hands on the floor at rucks both for defending and attacking teams.  OK, I'm living on fantasy island....But I am becoming disillusioned [/QUOTE

Absolutely agree Moseley Mauler.
Straight put ins
Free kicks for scrum offences
Rolling Mauls from line out’s banned from inside 23
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FlyingRuck View Drop Down
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Points: 157 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FlyingRuck Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Oct 2023 at 08:37
Well said. Totally agree.
See you further on up the road
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PropDad View Drop Down
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Points: 547 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PropDad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Oct 2023 at 08:46
Although it may not have been the most exciting match (there were quite a few better throughout the tournament) it’s commendable that the Boks won each of the last three matches by just a single point 👏👏👏
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islander View Drop Down
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Points: 7870 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote islander Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Oct 2023 at 09:14
Put-ins to scrums haven't been straight for years, but have reached ridiculous angles. Ref in England v Fiji did actually warn the Fijian scrum-half after one that must have been 70 if not 75 degrees off perpendicular...
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WEvans View Drop Down
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Points: 1456 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WEvans Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Oct 2023 at 14:37
Originally posted by islander islander wrote:

Originally posted by Halliford Halliford wrote:

I found the match compelling. NZ lost because of two missed kicks and two key handling errors. SA won because they didn’t make mistakes at key points. I thought the refereeing team were calm, assured, communicative and applied the current Laws well - not their job to determine whether those Laws are correct.


Agree Halliford, thought Barnes did well; comparing his calm authority with Nic Berry being on the verge of losing control (of a lower-stakes game) the night before reveals a night and day difference.

But the TMO thing is increasingly random - some incidents referred, others not, little or no transparency regarding the bunker. And apparently (Daily Telegraph reports) death threats to the ref on social media during the game. How sad...

Whereas death threats to match officials are clearly disgraceful and totally out of order I do wonder if too much notice is taken on what a few morons say on social media. With just about everyone having access to social media it is almost inevitable that a tiny number will post something offensive regarding just about everything. 


Edited by WEvans - 30 Oct 2023 at 14:38
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Paul10 View Drop Down
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Points: 914 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Paul10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Oct 2023 at 15:03
As we discuss refs, did anyone else notice the difference in attitude or approach to the ref by the captains or talkers in the teams.

Farrell and George (when he came on) were in Berry's ear the whole time.

I don't remember Cane, Kolisi, Savea or Fourie querying any decisions.

Le Roux seemed to stay well out of Barnes' eyeline.

At least, it caught my attention.
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